Wednesday, September 28, 2011

The Holy Grail of Weight Loss III


...CONTINUED FROM THE LAST POST

ME: This ties in to one of my strongest philosophies on money - it's better to make a little bit of money doing what you love than making a ton of money doing what you hate. The same could be said of living a "healthy lifestyle." A pound lost doing something enjoyable is worth more than 10 pounds lost doing something excruciatingly difficult - like starving yourself or doing unwanted exercise. The word 'sustainable' is sheer poetry - up there with 'unprocessed.' And this concept is really important when you consider the fact that you have been losing weight consistently for almost 2 years steady. Who could do unwanted exercise and deprive themselves of food for 2 years? Not me. And as you know, the metabolic consequences of doing so can be quite severe.


Now I'm sure everyone is curious... Could you tell us what kind of foods that you enjoy and were able to eat? What did a typical day of eating look like for you?

SASHA:  You are absolutely right. Chronic dieters have this imaginary wagon or track that they like to talk about being on and there are always a myriad of reasons for them to "fall off the wagon" or "go off-track." I've seen a lot of this in the past two years of associating with people who diet, which to me is very different from people who heal their bodies. A lot of this has to do with food. I love talking about the way I eat because I love food and both my husband and I love cooking and looking for new sources of whole food. At first it was difficult, we had to spend a little time and research to suss out our sources for the right kinds of foods. I wanted to stay away from grocery store foods for the bulk of our shopping, so this meant the local farmer's market, local produce sellers, people who sell pastured chickens and eggs, etc. We found a couple of butchers, and while the price is going to be a little higher, it’s worthwhile to have local product. We even managed to find a fish monger where we buy our seafood. We taste the difference and the nutrient value is also a plus.

Surprisingly we've done this all on a budget with a few extravagances like buying ghee and coconut oil from our local health food store. We just stay away from the processed "health" foods and expensive organic produce. If my produce is a little damaged but in season and comes from a local source who raises smaller crops organically, this is going to be cheaper than a large chain like Whole Foods. Learn how to shop locally and according to season for the best prices.

Typically we favor yogurt and in season fruit for our breakfasts or pastured eggs. We normally eat a second large meal but not a third, skipping dinner. We favor beef and game meats, our butcher carries a large selection of meats; fowl, buffalo, elk, sausages made in house. We're especially fond of braising meats because there are so many ways of braising and the "low and slow" method in the BBQ during the summer. Legumes, sweet potatoes, squash, locally-grown corn, chard, greens, whatever is in season, with plenty of butter. A little fruit but not too much. We live where berries are plentiful and we incorporate these into our diet when they're in season. We make our own pizzas and ice cream so we can control what goes in them, but again, this is not to make food necessarily less fatty but to avoid processed foods. The bottom line is, we keep things very simple and basic.

I talked about the lack of quality product coming out of fast food restaurants and chain/corporate restaurants. Our bodies need nutrient dense, fatty foods but we eat bad quality foods that are doctored up with a lot of sodium and HFCS. How do you think a place like Red Lobster is able to afford to sell you lobster for $9.99? Bad quality food and bad nutrition leaves your body lacking and still craving so you eat more bad food and so forth. Obviously I have a vendetta against these types of restaurants but I'm so well fed and satiated, there's no danger that I'll binge on packages of diet cookies because of uncontrollable cravings. There's no imaginary wagon or track for me to fall of off. Not once in two years have I ever thought of my weight loss in those terms.

I just want people to know that this is real and I'm not crazy. I really do EAT.

ME:  You say that you weren't eating dinner. Was this something you did all along or started up recently with all the talk about eating light in the evening? Did you eat anything at dinner at all? And how long did it take for your body to adjust to this eating schedule where you really weren't hungry in the evening? I'm very curious about this because it could be a pivotal maneuver in your weight loss, AND I'm even thinking about re-working RRARF to advise overfeeding until 2pm and then coasting into the evening with a very light meal - to reap the same rewards, but make weight gain a less frequent occurrence. Do tell…

SASHA:  To be honest, the meal schedule wasn't deliberate at all but rather accidental. It started a little over a year ago mostly due to my husband's weird schedule and also because we had become used to eating when we were hungry and noticing that our hunger was greatest after 11 and before 2 in the afternoon. We thought it was because we would cycle, hike or run in the mid-mornings, but regardless of what we do or don't do, this eating pattern simply seems natural. I imagine that people who eat a lot of "lite" processed diet foods and non-fat foods are constantly fighting their appetites (and probably why they just give up on losing weight). The more you get into the habit of eating whole foods and nutrient dense meals, the less time the body begs to be fed constantly. At first you may overeat and gain weight but eventually your body's mechanism gets the signal that it is being fed. My personal experience has told me that obeying my body and appetite should be a priority. If I seem to gain a couple of pounds one week because I was hungrier a couple of days and ate more, the weight comes back off the next week then drops even further. The weight doesn't stay on a logical schedule which I know makes a lot of people crazy, but it will continue a downward trend.

Any eating after 2 is very light and this schedule seems to give my body a chance to catch up and rest during the evening hours and overnight. Some days, if there's a need or desire, I can switch things up and have a heavier dinner if I eat lighter during the day, but I don't do this often, probably once or twice a month at the most. I've learned to be flexible.

ME:  Amen on not being hungry when you have nourished yourself properly earlier in the day. My most recent studies have highlighted just how truly natural this eating pattern is. And I do believe it's a useful tool for weight loss - not starving yourself at night that is, but eating enough early to naturally be satisfied in the afternoon and evening. Once again, the focus is on eating more at the right time, and allowing the "eating less" part to occur spontaneously.

Anyway, this is exactly what I have sought after all along - trying to get people to ignore everything and focus on nourishing themselves, answering the physiological call of their hunger with quality nourishment, and letting things fall where they may. If anything, you seem to have succeeded because you are even MORE dedicated to that self-commitment than others. It's amazing to see the trust that you've developed for your body, nourishing it and letting it sort things out on its own. I think a lot of people, by the time they get near 400 pounds, have an extreme DISTRUST for themselves and a strong love-hate relationship with food. Congrats to you and your husband for overcoming such barriers. Very few people at your former weight and age ever have the kind of success that you have had. But I hope this interview will lead to many more light bulbs going off, and more people will have the courage to do what you've done, and display the kind of patience you've displayed. Thank you so much for taking the time to do this Sasha. Can't wait to see where you are in another 2 years.

33 comments:

  1. First again. You're going to think I'm becoming a stalker. ;-)

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  2. Wow, great stuff. Congrats Sasha and thanks to you and Matt for sharing. After years of dieting and restrictive behaviors around food it is really hard to follow my intuition because I succeeded in thoroughly smashing it out. But i'm learning slowly. It was easier for me to do that with exercise than food, I have to say. But thanks for all of the ideas.

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  3. Uh-mazing. It would be sort of sad if the main reason Americans cannot get healthy is that we are waiting to be told what to do, and are incapable of trusting ourselves and our bodies.

    And aren't there so many philosophical aspects to this? What has trained us to be like this? How did we lose what is natural and instinctive?

    Thanks for sharing all this, Matt!

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  4. This was a great interview.

    I'd be interested to hear more about the difference between the "mostly whole foods" diet and the "entirely whole foods" diet.

    I'm super wary of the eat a lot in the morning and afternoon eating pattern because it's very difficult for my life. Most days, I do well to get some breakfast and a lunch that is whole foods-based. Quantity early in the day for people with 9-5 desk jobs is really tough. Basically the only time I have to sit down and eat a nice, big meal is in the evening. I can feel that my body doesn't really want to eat that way because when I go on vacay, I'm always up for big breakfasts and lunch and often skip dinner and go for a snack in the evening.

    I loved what she had to say about shopping at farmer's markets etc. and avoiding the Whole Foods trap. People never believe me when I tell them I spend less on groceries shopping local and organic at my co-op and farmers market than I would at a chain discount grocery store. I save huge amounts of money by not eating out at lunch anymore.

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  5. It depends on the person Nipper - when it comes to the entirely vs. mostly whole foods approach. I'd say the two people who have achieved the greatest leanness since finding 180DegreeHealth are two guys who were eating a 100% whole foods, low-carb diet (one was ZERO CARB) when they found the site and are now subsisting primarily on pizza, burgers, and beer. I may actually post on this tomorrow, as one of the guys filmed a video of himself eating an entire pizza with a Coke and then flashed his Bruce Lee abs afterward.

    So no universal principles can be applied. There are always big surprises out there, and no universal absolute truths. I've lost a considerable amount of fat in the last 2 months eating quite a bit of refined food, but eating very light in the evening like Sasha mentions.

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  6. Just curious to know if Sasha & her hubby have lost any hair.
    The before and after pics give the impression that their hair has thinned a bit since the weight loss.

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  7. Very interesting read indeed. I feel a real kinship to Sasha. Our stories are rather similar in so many ways! Though I suspect I'm considerably older than Sasha, LOL. But I also started my journey at 375 pounds, and have lost 125 pounds to date without starving myself or exercising like a fiend. Like Sasha I sill have a ways to go on my journey. But in the meantime I don't starve myself and I enjoy eating. I do limit carbs to a fair extent as 1) it gives me better blood sugar control, and 2) there are not many carby things that I'm interested in eating. I avoid grains as much as possible, especially wheat. But I love my butter and cream cheese and coconut oil and eggs. I enjoy walking my dog, and going on birding walks, and I adore lap swimming when I have access to a pool. To me lap swimming is like a zen-like meditation.

    As Sasha says, the key is to do things you ENJOY, things you can last a lifetime on. I've been on this journey seriously since the beginning of 2009. That's almost three years. No one can spend three years starving themselves and forcing themselves into exercises they hate. It just ain't natural!

    I live in Florida so my need to supplement with vitamin D is probably less than someone who lives in the Pacific northwest, but I still do supplement. I do take a few supplements and am working on getting my thyroid optimized (been hypothyroid for many years, many of which I could not get a doctor to treat me either).

    But the journey is far more pleasan when you can enjoy your food and activities! Kudos to Sasha and her husband. I feel like we're on a very similar journey.

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  8. P.S. you can see my own "before" and "now" photos at my own silly little inactive blog at:
    http://healingartoffood.blogspot.com/

    I started it document the things I felt I'd learned about health and nutrition along the way. but the longer I spend on this journey the less I feel like I know! But I think you would still agree the photos tell a story that I've managed some success on this journey.

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  9. What was she eating that got her too her highest weight? I'm thinking that lowering food reward played a big role in her success.

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  10. It is an inspiring story, especially because she has clearly found what has worked for her. However, based on her own experience, she makes assumptions about what others are doing in order to _not_ get results that may not be accurate.

    For example, for some of us, overexercising and restricting is actually much _easier_ than 'eating the food'--witness my recent confession that every time I've tried to follow a tweak (e.g. lighter dinner) it has always, _every time_, led to more calorie restricting 'under the radar.' Restricting is more a default setting than a 'wagon' to 'fall off.'

    I never eat processed foods, btw, and make everything from scratch. But I don't eat animal products, and I notice that she's very big on them, more so than on starches as far as I can tell. Would be interesting to hear more thoughts on that vis-a-vis satiation.

    I'm really glad that this has been an easy path of persistence for her. It may offer hope to a lot of people--just maybe not so much for restricter-types.

    Like Savalas, I also wondered about the hairloss...

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  11. @Savalas - I'd like to address the issue of the hair loss. The hair loss actually happened after I'd gained the weight and peaked out just before I started losing weight. My hair was actually thinner at the crown but has grown back quite alot. Also keep in mind that the hair cut is very different and so the part in the middle and hair freshly flatironed (something I didn't do when the before picture was taken) will make my hair look flatter and thinner and accentuate the area that was thinning. As for my husband, he has not lost hair. When his hair is longer, it is extremely thick and wavy but when he has his hair very short, it appears thinner but it isn't. :)

    @Ela - the reason I make these assumptions is because I've made a deliberate effort to observe the "dieting" habits of people in a dieting community. These assumptions are far from uninformed, trust me. :) I'm not sure if you meant that you think that the path I've taken is easy. It isn't really easy, it's taken a lot of patience and consistency and learning about my own body. If I make it sound like it's easy, what I mean is that I no longer have any fear of gaining weight back. This is something that is very very liberating.

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  12. Sasha,

    Thanks for your response. I didn't _at all_ mean to imply that you thought it was easy: I totally recognize that you have done some phenomenal self-reprogramming there and have been very intelligent in what you chose to do and how you did it.

    I even agree with a lot of your characterizations of the 'dieting community'--I just wanted to mention that for those of us who have had severe anorexia in the past and have metabolic issues as a result, the relaxing into eating the food path can seem impossibly difficult and doesn't yield as obviously good results as quickly.

    Blessings to you!
    Ela

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  13. Sasha,

    Thanks for sharing. I hope more and more people have experience like yours trusting themselves, and the growing numbers of those stories can help us all learn more how to effectively regain our health and sense of well being over the long term.

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  14. So happy for your progress, Sasha. I think the power of trusting your body and giving it what it wants is really strong. People are always really surprised when I tell them I really don't crave junk. Once you're accustomed to eating whole foods and listen to your body and give it what it wants, you start craving stuff like oatmeal, fruit, meat, cheese, veggies even (and I used to crave sugar and stuff all the time, and would restrict it, etc.) I eat a mostly whole foods diet, I think, probably 90-95% whole foods.

    I agree with Jenny on the difficulty of a big meal at lunch when you work at an office. Lately, I've been having a good lunch with meat, but then have been having an afternoon snack with some protein (like yogurt and a slice of toast) and that seems to work for me (I then eat dinner, but not super big). My body seems to be doing well with this as long as I have protein at breakfast. That's been key.

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  15. Ela, I agree that restricting can be an easy default for people with ED history. I try to be really mindful of it and specifically be conscious of not restricting. It's always going to be an easy reflex (like when I get more stressed I know I get more restrictive), but I at least see red flags go up now (sounds like you do, too), and awareness is half the battle.

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  16. @Sasha,

    Thanks for your response.
    Best wishes to you both.

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  17. I have also been thinking about the social and cultural restrictions around eating a light meal in the evening. For us, I am stay at home mum, DP off to work, and next year, DD off to school, when we are all home together in the evening is the time we like to enjoy a good home cooked meal together 'eating the food'. Can't see myself packing stews or casserole or roast into daughter's lunch box!

    though for me, at my most healthiest times (similar on vacation) i really do gravitate to big breaky and lunch, and less in the evening.

    Thanks Sasha for sharing your inspiring and practical story.

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  18. "...by the time they get near 400 pounds, have an extreme DISTRUST for themselves and a strong love-hate relationship with food."

    Yes, that's exactly what happened to me. Still recovering from it.
    Learning to trust one's own appetite and judgment is not easy when you are told by everyone that you must be doing something wrong because look at the size of ya.

    I'm glad you found your groove, Sasha!

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  19. I'm curious, specific times (e.g 11 am and 2 pm) are mentioned frequently, but this assumes being a "morning person". How does one adapt this if one is nocturnal?

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  20. Being "nocturnal" is a sign that your sugars are low all day and finally rise in the afternoon and evening. This is generally an unhealthy pattern. Part of the RBTI program that I've been writing about lately is about restoring normal circadian rhythms.

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  21. Hey Matt, if you're around - can you puhleaasie ask Pippa how she got the urea chemicals to HI? I'm having no luck.

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  22. I think someone just shipped them out to her. Not supposed to be shipped out, but she got lucky I guess.

    You can do pretty well with just pH and refractometer readings if it comes to that though.

    You could always email me your mailing adress and I could see if Santa will stop by there.

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  23. Excellent work Sasha and hubby!

    I see undertones of intermittent fasting, which I am fooling around with (again). This is similar to what Matt has been saying in regards to RBTI, how Bob Delmontique eats, and how Walter Bruening ate while he was alive (he died at 114 or 115 as the worlds oldest man).

    I'm thinking that one of the reasons that Ela may have a problem with this type of eating plan (i.e. the light or no evening meal) is that she does not eat animal products. Looking at animals in the wild, the carnivores (like the big cats) only eat once every few days, while the vegans (like cows) tend to graze all day long. Not saying that this is an absolute in the animal kingdom and that everyone should adhere to this kind of principle, but may help to explain what we are witnessing here.

    Great work!

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  24. Will,

    Interesting observation.

    --

    Sasha and hubby,

    Thank you for sharing your story! Wishing you continued health improvement and happiness :)

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  25. "This ties in to one of my strongest philosophies on money - it's better to make a little bit of money doing what you love than making a ton of money doing what you hate." - Matt


    Ditto! :)

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  26. AS--ditto thrice!

    Will--cow-girl here ;) I had been thinking some similar things and as an experiment, had a protein-loaded lunch today. I had a whole single-serve packet of Garden of Life "Raw Meal", which has 270 cals and 34g protein (probably more protein than I've been eating some whole days!) with a few more calories thrown in there too.

    I was totally full all afternoon and haven't wanted much in the way of dinner. I did almost puke, though, and that always seems to be the downside of a heavier lunch, but I can work back from there and just try 'higher protein,' not 'excessively high' and see how that feels for longterm satiation.

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  27. Will-

    I've got nothing against IF as long as people know, understand, and are familiar with the signs and symptoms that it is causing metabolic distress (cold hands and feet, dropping body temps, digestive problems, mood disorders, waning sex drive, etc.).

    Interestingly, I experienced most of those in the early days of doing this - during the transition. It seems most have improved though, as if the biggest factor was just adjusting to that schedule more than anything else.

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  28. Wow, there is hope! Congratulations. I noticed that Sasha didn't strictly stay away from sugar (ice cream.) I was curious if she used a natural sweetener regularly or if that was a rare occasion?

    Are there any kids in the house? I have 5 kids still at home and I don't see them being thrilled about 100% non-processed! Any tips on how to make that work?

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  29. Not sure how often Sasha had ice cream. Or natural sweeteners.

    As for kids - no one likes the transition from processsed to unprocessed food. There is a digestive transition, and more importantly, there are withdrawals from taking away the more stimulating foods.

    I think the kids will respond kinda like these gorillas... Pissed at first, but then they got used to it and ended up healthier for it. But don't be too psycho mom on them!

    http://180metabolism.com/blog/?p=145

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  30. I gained 40 pounds doing HED and now I'm freaking out a little bit. I'm kind of leaning towards dieting again. Help this diet and overexercise junkie stay on track to losing the excess weight.

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  31. I wouldn't say that having an emotional freak attack is the time to make big diet decisions.

    Nothing wrong with eating a little less and getting some exercise, as long as you induce low appetite and high energy and it comes as naturally as possible.

    I think just eating light in the evening like Sasha did and doing some exercise that really is fun and exhilirating and you will hopefully start leaning out, eventually being lean and healthy instead of lean and effed up (like so many that have lost weight are).

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  32. Thanks Matt!
    I'm freaking out because I kind of felt out of control.
    At the gym,there are a lot of skinny girls with fake boobs who work out 10 hours a week! I'm taking yoga and going to try zumba classes to get some fun exercise in. I will implement eating light in the evening.If milk is a part of the diet is that to be consumed before 2 pm as well?

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  33. Kaisen-

    Depending on intensity level, there's nothing wrong with a healthy person getting 10 hours of exercise per week. When I live close to some good hiking trails I easily get in 10 hours of exercise per week, which is no problem if you know how to eat and rest to recover properly.

    Milk is fine any time.

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